I prefer the VR, could be cause i have a vrt, but still....
I dont quite understand why everyone is talking about being able to get more hp out of the 1.8t cheaper.... exhaust and comparable mods equal the same sort of gains i believe in the 1.8t vs the vr... granted you can turn up the boost on a 1.8 with a chip, but the aggressive tuning for the na vr's is nice too....
also i prefer the sound of the vr over the 1.8t, granted a very happy spooling turbo is always nice...
so in the end vr over 1.8 for sound, and the ability to do a vrt
well lets look at it from the other end of the scale, large builds, big turbo 1.8t or big turbo vr6....
both kits cost around the same $ figure, and which car makes more power?
so its all about perspective and how you want to look at it.....
and a giac x chip will bring a 1.8t to about 225hp, a full c2 tune on na vr6 is about 216 or so..
in the end dollar for dollar, you can get more out of a vr
Yea I'm not saying that a VR6 doesn't have more potential. If you can do the full build and turbo it then your gonna make more power. Put 1.8t's can still get pretty high up there in the HP numbers. You also have to remember that these are FWD cars so at a certain point it doesn't matter how much power your car makes cause it won't be able to put it down and both motors have the ability to reach that point.
The numbers for those chips are assuming your car is completely stock (I know for sure about GIAC, but idk about C2). That still puts the 1.8t out in front. Throw on a the bolt-ons for each and the 1.8t runs walks away from a VR6.
i dont believe so, but i guess we all have our opinions.... and im basing this off a 01 glx vr6 vs a 1.8t my buddies did a highway pull and only basic bolt ons/tunes on both cars, and there was no clear winner....
on another note... these boost controllers you have, pm me with info on one pls
Okay well if you look at the numbers thats how it works out. I have a 1.8t with all the bolt-ons and I walked away from a VR6 with a tune and bolt-ons.
lets upgrade that a lil bit....
a cam'd vrt = sex
Nice more sex haha
VR6 - Why? Simply because I own one, and its a f*cking hot rod.
In my quest for my MKIV I test drove both (not necessarily gingerly either), both engines were connected to a auto tranny, (VR was a 12v) and I have to say what won me over was the instant-on torque of the VR. Don't get me wrong, I loved the kick of the turbo but in the end I subscribed to the phrase; "There's no replacement for displacement", and the VR = SEX debate doesn't apply to me, been married for 22 yrs now, wife could have cared less which one I bought!
about the earlier battle about the vr6 and 1.8t being the same price for more power. thats complete BS! haha. i own a vr6. i have 262 cams, lightened flywheel, light weight pulleys, full exhaust, and intake. i rebuilt the motor, and im maybe at like 210hp 220 tq after a stage 2 tune with cam software. with a 1.8t, exhaust, intake, and chip, you can make 250hp and more in tq. the BT statement is so irrelevant because once you are spending like 10 grand on a build, price isnt exactly an issue. that being said, if you really want a ton of power, a fwd car is not the way to go. you need an awd r32 or do a tranny swap. but honestly, come on. just do some simple pricing. i spent 6 grand on rebuilding my motor (most of this was maintenance cause the previous owner killed her) but i gained like 30 hpish and 40 tqish. you can spend like 2 grand on a 1.8t and gain 50hp and 50tq. not exactly a contest.
all this being said, im a fan of both motors. not many cars on the market that can handle 500+ hp without blowing up (aka hondas :P )
well i have driven both the 1.8t and the vr6 but in my personal favorite is the 2.0 slow with a supercharger buts that just me but if i had to chose i would say the 1.8t because the all wheel drive system in the vr6 is flawed now that is the type i have driven.
"Forget Ricers, German Performance is where its at."
I personally have a 2001 vr6. my friend and i straight piped it and it sounds horrid. he has an '08 mustang and i put my muffler back on and am soon to do the same with the resonator. just doesn't sounds very good to other straight piped cars
Oh my, where did you get this exceptional piece of artwork? I must have one! lol
I'm surprised I didn't see this thread before. Let me make it easy.
I put $1400 in performance parts into my 1.8T, which includes a 3'' mandrel bent turboback exhaust (magnaflow cat/muffler), turbo inlet pipe, APR stage 2 tune, and some custom timing work through V-Tune/Lemmiwinks (both free downloadable programs). I make ~235whp, ~275wtq. And thats being generous. I also get 33 miles per gallon on winter blend fuel, and 35 on summer blend. And that's not with me being nice on the ol' girl. And that's not highway mileage, it's average city/highway. With contental tires all around, I lose traction in first and second gear, third and fourth if its wet out. So the need for a BT setup is not there, at all, unless you like getting 100+mph speeding tickets... Because the only thing you ever need a BT setup for is highway pulls. Peak torque output on a 1.8T is at 1800RPM's... That's pretty much diesel territory. Unless I were going to bore the cylinders to make more horsepower and leave added torque on the backburner, the FWD setup can't handle it for buzzing around town. And dont' be mistaken, although the tiny turbo struggles at highway speeds, my passing gear is 6th, sometimes 5th if I'm multi-passing lol.
So what do you get with your VR for $1400? A cam, tune, intake, exhaust, maybe some cooling gaskets... And you make low 200's with what kind of MPG?
I love both motors... Both have won awards, both are strong, and they both sound nasty with exhausts. I'll even give it to the VR for sounding even more snarly... But when it comes down to it, the 1.8T is a better value for performance and economy. If the VR's came RWD or AWD, this would be an entirely different story.
3.2l 24v VR6 AWD with 230 hp. Only problem is its in an R32. I've never argued the fact that the 1.8t is cheaper to mod, but with deep pockets the vr6 can easily surpass the 1.8t. Vr's are also nice for those that want power without doing engine mods, which was my intention at first.
To settle this all both motors can make more then enough power to make them inoperable as fwd cars. Overall 1.8t can make more power cheaper then a VR6 and no matter what a 1.8t will give you decent gas mileage at the same time.
btw Chris I got that sweatshirt and couple shirts from here.
Well I do like me a good burnout every now and then, but I do a lot of highway pulls and I have an addiction to speed.
Anyways BT is just to hold me over till I can get my r36 motor and bora 4motion drivetrain Not gonna tell you the full plan for that, but I will tell you that my goal is 1500hp and it will be daily driven XD First Getta to do a standing 4wheel burnout
So on topic again. 2.0<vr6<1.8t<VRT< My dream R36
To me if your looking for any kind of real power (300+ whp) Vr is the way to go. Its cheaper and more reliable. Stock vr motor with just a headgasket spacer has proven time and time again to hold up with 400+ whp, where as anything around 350 or more on a 1.8t you need to start lookin and upgrading rods, and anything over 400 your looking at some major engine building, which is going to cost a lot more than buying a tuned and ready to go out of the box kit for a vr from kinetic or somewhere like that, or build a kit yourself if you have the knowhow.
That is not true... I will give you that at 300 whp your lookin at rods for the 1.8t, but after you do just rods your good to like 750hp i believe it is before you have to do pistons. If you wanna make 400+hp on a VR you maybe able to get away without rods and just a head spacer, but you are still gonna have to replace the plastic intake mani.
The thing is if you wanna make a high horsepower reliable car you are gonna need to do more then what I just said, but I'm just proving my point that its not all the much extra work.
Wow 750 hp hun on stock internals Actually my info is correct. How about you email apr and see what they tell ya?? As for the plastic mani I hate mkIV's so I dont have to worry about that. MKIII is aluminum.